It seems that in my earlier spanking post I've attracted an anonymous poster who thinks I'm wrong about spanking. When I pointed out that I was already glad my mother spanked even while she still was doing it, this poster assumed it was because of 'early indoctrination'. How convenient it is to assume that you are right and anyone who disagrees intelligently was 'indoctrinated'. We are all indoctrinated to one degree or another. Anyone who doesn't recognize that is missing an important part of logic and reasoning.
I'll tell you what hurts a child. Among people who declare in self-righteousness that they would never spank a child because it's violent and hurtful, I see an increasing amount of name-calling. They try to control their children through shame, using words like "stupid" or "bratty" that I never use with my child. I can't tell you how many times I've heard an angry mother hiss from a nearby supermarket row, "I'm calling you a BRAT because that's what you ARE."
For heaven's sake, woman, take the kid out to the car and give him a smack on the butt. The sting will fade in less than two minutes and what it will teach him is that behavior has consequences. But if repetition makes 'stupid' and 'bratty' his identity, he's sunk! I have never, ever called my son 'stupid' and he is not allowed to call other people 'stupid'. Things, ideas, events, yes. People, no.
The truth is, people are not born knowing how to control themselves. From potty training to getting to the office on time, they need to learn how to 'take the reins' and do what they need to do. Parents who will not do what's necessary to keep control seem to be a lot more desperate when a child will not behave. A parent who keeps control merely watches calmly and might even allow further misbehavior before the child 'reaps what he sows'. That parent may barter, but he does not plead. He may speak, but he does not need to scream.
Discipline your child. Create for him a safe world in which the consequences for bad behavior are uncomfortable. Keep those consequences age-appropriate rather than instantly realistic. Young children should not be facing adult consequences. You don't have to spank every child to do it right. Any and all parts of your toolbox will depend on both parent and child. But please, please don't resort to name-calling and don't ever tear your child down.
That's probably a far better response than the one I had in your earlier post. Trust me, I'd rather feel my own hand stinging, knowing that my son's butt stings just as much (or maybe less, he does tend to have a few layers of fabric protecting him, my hand doesn't) when he does something he knows is wrong than letting him destroy everything around him... Thankfully we never resorted to name-calling, but we came terribly close on occasion.
ReplyDeleteI was called a lot of names growing up (mostly by other kids, but a few of my family members joined in on occasion) and it did a number on my self-image. It took a long time for me to not think of myself as stupid, lazy, useless, or nothing more than a burden (that last one was my aunt). Most of that work was done by my wife (Thanks dear!), and I still have to remind myself on occasion that I was never any of those things. So I whole-heartedly agree.
Thanks again, and keep writing!
Hey, I'm glad my little writeup is helping! :)
ReplyDeleteI too was called a lot of names during part of my childhood, only by other kids, never by family members. It took me a while to get over the stupid/worthless/ugly self-image. That's part of why I get so mad when I see parents doing it to their children. Whatever happened to me at public school, my home was always my haven, and I strive to make this home a haven for my husband and son.
It is so, so, so very important for family to not tear each other down. Family is where you get built up so that you can go out there and stand against society trying to tear you down.
Thank you for the encouragement on writing! Writing is such a part of me that I do it whether anyone's listening or not, but knowing that people are listening and enjoying makes it just so much easier to share. Reference earlier paragraph... the tearing-down in my public school years still affects me to this day, and I still struggle with the notion that I might actually be able to contribute to society in a meaningful manner.
I certainly agree that children need discipline. If your children are behaving in a way that requires physical punishment to get them to stop, then I think it is time to examine your parenting skills. You cannot blame other people's children for your child's behavior. I also agree that name calling and general demoralizing is abusive to children. I do have children, and I somehow managed to raise them to be well behaved and kind- without spanking or name-calling.
ReplyDeleteTo Fuzzyhubby: I don't see how posting as anonymous is any different than posting as 'fuzzyhubby'. I do have children, and they do not, nor have they ever, had the kind of behavior problems you describe with your own child. Perhaps you should have him evaluated by a child psychologist. It sounds to me like he is acting out to get attention. Children who are ignored or abused often act out in negative ways. Also, I believe that if a child is spanked for bad behavior, he doesn't learn to be well behaved, he only learns to fear a spanking.
The last thing I would want is for someone to tell me how I should raise my children, so I would like to apologize for my straight-forwardness. I am sure that you love your children and act out of love and what you believe is right. Again, my only hope was that you might reconsider the need to use physical punishment. I recommend this website:
www.nurturingparenting.com
Anonymous one, if you really intend to gently instruct and don't want to sound like you're telling us how to raise our children, perhaps you should wait for three hours and then reread your posts before hitting Publish.
ReplyDeleteBecause what you said, condensed, was: "You should never spank your kids. Your kid acts up because you're neglecting him and abusing him. You need to go make him see a psychologist." Your 'softening statements' didn't do much to ease your previous statements. "Oh, I'm sure you love your kid and you don't MEAN to neglect and abuse him..." Think of what that sounds like for a moment.
I don't know why I thought telling you how horrible it is to hurt your kids would make you change. Obviously, since you are already doing it and recommending it to other people, you will never change. I hope when your children are grown, they will be wise and patient enough to discipline their own children without the same abuse you bestowed on them. The cycle needs to be broken.
ReplyDeleteI don't know why you thought that slamming my parenting skills and scoffing at my family traditions would make me want to change, either. I guess there's just no figuring out some people.
ReplyDeleteI don't really care whether my grown child (children?) spank or not. Frankly, your ignorance of my family is astounding, and I'm always amused to see people lecturing from a point of ignorance.
Why don't you read my most recent discipline post? Since it doesn't involve the word 'spank', you might actually be able to contribute something besides the old 'spanking is evil, spanking is evil, spanking is evil, spanking is evil' point.
Of course I'm ignorant of your family. ? What's your point? My point is that your 'family traditions' include abusing your children and no matter how nicely you do it, hitting your children is downright evil! They are small, innocent beings with no way of defending themselves against adults. You could try teaching your children right from wrong with WORDS and not violence. The whole diet/exercise thing is just basic parenting. Congratulations, you got at least one thing right.
ReplyDeleteThis is starting to get more and more interesting. The more you say, the more you sound like a broken record, and one who has never babysat. Are you aware that children are not born knowing words?
ReplyDeleteHow do you teach what "hot" means?
How do you teach what "No" means?
Words are simply placeholders for meanings from the real world. "Sour" means nothing until you eat a lemon or similar. Of course, you don't want a child to learn "Hot" by burning themselves. The best technique I've seen yet is to place the child's hand against something hot enough to cause discomfort while cool enough to avoid injury and repeat the word HOT. The next time the kid reaches for a candle you say "HOT!" and the kid stops, because he remembers that "HOT" doesn't feel good.
Until a kid knows that touching some things hurts, it makes no sense whatsoever to the kid to avoid touching anything.
When you equate all spanking with abuse, you label roughly 94% of young parents in this country as child abusers. That's a pretty massive claim. Do you honestly believe that 80-95% of the world population today is being systematically abused? How frightened you must be! How many of them do you think are going to be criminals? 50% of the population? 80%? How do you know that 8 out of 10 of the people who walk past on the street aren't suddenly going to race up and bludgeon you to death because their parents gave them a swat on the butt once? You must think you see hundreds of evil, evil people every single day. How does that affect your psyche, to believe something like that?
I think a swat on the butt does less damage to a kid than being taught that 90% of the world is evil.
I taught my child what hot was by mimicking pain myself, for example: I have always had candles lit around my home. When my child showed interest in the candle, I showed him, by moving MY hand over the flame, and saying Ouch! That's hot! Don't touch! Something similar for sour foods. I do not need to inflict pain on a child to impress on them that something will hurt. They learn 'hurt' in other ways, like falling down, bumping into things, whatever.
ReplyDeleteI do realize that there is a large percentage of people out there using this barbaric form of parenting. I do not think they are all evil, but you are correct that I am afraid. Violence begets violence. I do not look at everyone and think they are evil, but I do think they are stupid. If there is a way to teach and discipline without inflicting pain, why on earth would you CHOOSE to still do it?
Wow.
ReplyDeleteWell, it sure beats walking around being afraid all the time and believing that the majority of the world is made up of stupid people.
I think I'll keep my worldview, thanks, especially if it means teaching my son tolerance instead of fear.
I don't really think tolerance is the issue here. Social opinions that I may or may not pass to my children are entirely different than physically injuring them. I don't walk around being afraid all the time. I am just generally fearful that the number of stupid people in the world is growing, rapidly. It is not all to do with my opinions of their parenting.
ReplyDeleteThat's all besides the point here, though. I don't really care what your world view is, what you teach your children, as long as it doesn't harm them or others, and I do feel that physical punishment is harmful.
Well that's it for me. I can see you will never consider it harmful. I will not be nagging you anymore, but I may continue to lurk! :)
...please where can I buy a unicorn?
ReplyDeleteToy's section, pink aisle, take your pick. :) The others are not for sale.
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